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	<title>Comments on: In defense of the Tongan intervention</title>
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	<link>http://pacificempire.org.nz/2006/11/28/in-defense-of-the-tongan-intervention/</link>
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		<title>By: laminar_flow</title>
		<link>http://pacificempire.org.nz/2006/11/28/in-defense-of-the-tongan-intervention/comment-page-1/#comment-746</link>
		<dc:creator>laminar_flow</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 13 Dec 2006 21:34:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pacificempire.org.nz/?p=139#comment-746</guid>
		<description>Let&#039;s examine Australia&#039;s aid to the Pacific and compare that with Billion dollar purchase of US Arms.
Added to that, where is the accountability in invading Iraq under false pretences.

Regarding Peacekeeping, the ANZAC nations spend more money on their military industrial complex then spending money on improving trade policies and technology transfer.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let&#8217;s examine Australia&#8217;s aid to the Pacific and compare that with Billion dollar purchase of US Arms.<br />
Added to that, where is the accountability in invading Iraq under false pretences.</p>
<p>Regarding Peacekeeping, the ANZAC nations spend more money on their military industrial complex then spending money on improving trade policies and technology transfer.</p>
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		<title>By: Phil</title>
		<link>http://pacificempire.org.nz/2006/11/28/in-defense-of-the-tongan-intervention/comment-page-1/#comment-650</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Dec 2006 04:28:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pacificempire.org.nz/?p=139#comment-650</guid>
		<description>Ozguy, I agree with your concerns about Tonga&#039;s corrupt government.  But I don&#039;t think that the presence of Anzac soldiers constitutes propping that government up.  If the intervention had not occurred, we might have seen an escalation of violence, and potentially incidents of Tongan soldiers firing on protestors.  The presence of Anzac forces seemed to be instrumental in defusing tensions and maintaining peace.

I also agree with you about aid.  The contrast between the palaces and slums when I was last in Tonga was sickening.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Ozguy, I agree with your concerns about Tonga&#8217;s corrupt government.  But I don&#8217;t think that the presence of Anzac soldiers constitutes propping that government up.  If the intervention had not occurred, we might have seen an escalation of violence, and potentially incidents of Tongan soldiers firing on protestors.  The presence of Anzac forces seemed to be instrumental in defusing tensions and maintaining peace.</p>
<p>I also agree with you about aid.  The contrast between the palaces and slums when I was last in Tonga was sickening.</p>
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		<title>By: Phil</title>
		<link>http://pacificempire.org.nz/2006/11/28/in-defense-of-the-tongan-intervention/comment-page-1/#comment-649</link>
		<dc:creator>Phil</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 01 Dec 2006 04:23:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pacificempire.org.nz/?p=139#comment-649</guid>
		<description>Chirol and PC: In 1987 then PM David Lange wanted to send the SAS, Entebbe-style, into Suva to evacuate NZ nationals.  This was rightly judged unnecessary and provocative by the Defence Force, and the idea was dropped.

There have been several forces like what you describe, but ad hoc and definitely not rapid.  RAMSI is probably the most successful example, but they couldn&#039;t predict or prevent the riots that destroyed Honiara&#039;s Chinatown earlier this year.  I still think that the Biketawa Declaration, which requires an invitation from the affected government for an intervention, is unhelpful in terms of rapid response, and I would prefer some kind of response or intervention before the crisis hits, rather than after it is mostly over, as in the Solomons and Bougainville.  As events have shown, once the central government has collapsed or been taken over once, there is little to stop it happening again, and again.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chirol and PC: In 1987 then PM David Lange wanted to send the SAS, Entebbe-style, into Suva to evacuate NZ nationals.  This was rightly judged unnecessary and provocative by the Defence Force, and the idea was dropped.</p>
<p>There have been several forces like what you describe, but ad hoc and definitely not rapid.  RAMSI is probably the most successful example, but they couldn&#8217;t predict or prevent the riots that destroyed Honiara&#8217;s Chinatown earlier this year.  I still think that the Biketawa Declaration, which requires an invitation from the affected government for an intervention, is unhelpful in terms of rapid response, and I would prefer some kind of response or intervention before the crisis hits, rather than after it is mostly over, as in the Solomons and Bougainville.  As events have shown, once the central government has collapsed or been taken over once, there is little to stop it happening again, and again.</p>
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		<title>By: Chirol</title>
		<link>http://pacificempire.org.nz/2006/11/28/in-defense-of-the-tongan-intervention/comment-page-1/#comment-633</link>
		<dc:creator>Chirol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 29 Nov 2006 10:25:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pacificempire.org.nz/?p=139#comment-633</guid>
		<description>PC: Do you have anymore info on it?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>PC: Do you have anymore info on it?</p>
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		<title>By: Ozguy</title>
		<link>http://pacificempire.org.nz/2006/11/28/in-defense-of-the-tongan-intervention/comment-page-1/#comment-614</link>
		<dc:creator>Ozguy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Nov 2006 03:18:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pacificempire.org.nz/?p=139#comment-614</guid>
		<description>Tongan Aid:
if we consider the 10 million from Australia and a further 8 million from New Zealand, and the EU, ADB &amp; IMF all putting in millions as well, the streets of Tonga should be paved with Gold rather than broken concrete, and I am talking before the riots!

Imagine a city in New Zealand with the population of Tonga, say 100,000. Choose a city with that populous...say Nelson, Napier...Dunedien perhaps...Now imagine investing over 20 million dollars a year over 10 years into that city. Imagine the outome that you would have by now. The best schools, roads, services would be pristine!

So whats the problem with Tonga? Its had all the aid deserved, but not too many improvements...why?

Lack of good governance. Tonga is polluted with corruption within its government.

That corruption stems from the &quot;Constitutional Monarchy&quot; in which the king selects the ministers and Prime Minister. Hence those ministers must &quot;Tow the line&quot; to keep their jobs. they have no allegence to anything other than the king and what the king wants.

This would not be a bad thing, except the king himself is corrupt, taking what he wants from the public assets and forcing the parliament to make laws to protect his business interests-eliminating all other business opposition. This is having a devastating effect on the business economy of Tonga, not to mention scaring off any potential overseas investment that Tonga desperately needs.

Before any more aid is given in Tonga, consideration must be given to ensure that Tonga commits to a transparency and good governance. 

The riots will just be the beginning, as the people as tired of the corruption of the Monarchy and the government. People want the right to vote and to choose their leaders.

The governments of NZ &amp; Australia should not be supporting any government that denies its citizens the right to democracy and basic human rights. 

The interference of ANZAC troops within Tonga is only assisting the Tongan government with purging all its opponents, and silencing the critics of the government. 

With the presence of troops, the government is now busy eliminating the only non-government TV station, political opponents, and the business oppostion to the Royals. 

This is not the ANZAC way. This is not who we are. Our fathers fought for the freedom of others around the world in WWII.

Our troops should be serving to protect the rights of the Tongans to have free elections and the freedom of speech. - Not preventing it!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tongan Aid:<br />
if we consider the 10 million from Australia and a further 8 million from New Zealand, and the EU, ADB &amp; IMF all putting in millions as well, the streets of Tonga should be paved with Gold rather than broken concrete, and I am talking before the riots!</p>
<p>Imagine a city in New Zealand with the population of Tonga, say 100,000. Choose a city with that populous&#8230;say Nelson, Napier&#8230;Dunedien perhaps&#8230;Now imagine investing over 20 million dollars a year over 10 years into that city. Imagine the outome that you would have by now. The best schools, roads, services would be pristine!</p>
<p>So whats the problem with Tonga? Its had all the aid deserved, but not too many improvements&#8230;why?</p>
<p>Lack of good governance. Tonga is polluted with corruption within its government.</p>
<p>That corruption stems from the &#8220;Constitutional Monarchy&#8221; in which the king selects the ministers and Prime Minister. Hence those ministers must &#8220;Tow the line&#8221; to keep their jobs. they have no allegence to anything other than the king and what the king wants.</p>
<p>This would not be a bad thing, except the king himself is corrupt, taking what he wants from the public assets and forcing the parliament to make laws to protect his business interests-eliminating all other business opposition. This is having a devastating effect on the business economy of Tonga, not to mention scaring off any potential overseas investment that Tonga desperately needs.</p>
<p>Before any more aid is given in Tonga, consideration must be given to ensure that Tonga commits to a transparency and good governance. </p>
<p>The riots will just be the beginning, as the people as tired of the corruption of the Monarchy and the government. People want the right to vote and to choose their leaders.</p>
<p>The governments of NZ &amp; Australia should not be supporting any government that denies its citizens the right to democracy and basic human rights. </p>
<p>The interference of ANZAC troops within Tonga is only assisting the Tongan government with purging all its opponents, and silencing the critics of the government. </p>
<p>With the presence of troops, the government is now busy eliminating the only non-government TV station, political opponents, and the business oppostion to the Royals. </p>
<p>This is not the ANZAC way. This is not who we are. Our fathers fought for the freedom of others around the world in WWII.</p>
<p>Our troops should be serving to protect the rights of the Tongans to have free elections and the freedom of speech. &#8211; Not preventing it!</p>
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		<title>By: PC</title>
		<link>http://pacificempire.org.nz/2006/11/28/in-defense-of-the-tongan-intervention/comment-page-1/#comment-613</link>
		<dc:creator>PC</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 28 Nov 2006 00:20:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pacificempire.org.nz/?p=139#comment-613</guid>
		<description>Chirol, there was &quot;a Pacific Rapid Reaction Force built specifically to deal with Oceanic problems&quot; here in NZ when the first Fijian coup took place.  Lange lacked the will to use it.

And Phil: How dare you disagree with me.  Libertarians disagreeing!  Whatever next?  :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Chirol, there was &#8220;a Pacific Rapid Reaction Force built specifically to deal with Oceanic problems&#8221; here in NZ when the first Fijian coup took place.  Lange lacked the will to use it.</p>
<p>And Phil: How dare you disagree with me.  Libertarians disagreeing!  Whatever next?  <img src='http://pacificempire.org.nz/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Chirol</title>
		<link>http://pacificempire.org.nz/2006/11/28/in-defense-of-the-tongan-intervention/comment-page-1/#comment-608</link>
		<dc:creator>Chirol</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 27 Nov 2006 14:04:05 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://pacificempire.org.nz/?p=139#comment-608</guid>
		<description>However, small pacific islands represent real golden opportunities for intervention being considerably easier to contain, stabilize and make long term progress in. 

I&#039;d propose a Pacific Rapid Reaction Force built specifically to deal with Oceanic problems. It would initially consist of AU and NZ and later expand to include rising players. In addition, small numbers of other regional military could be embedded with the Anzacs to gain valuable trainign they can use in future interventions as well as at home. I&#039;ll be posting about this soon.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>However, small pacific islands represent real golden opportunities for intervention being considerably easier to contain, stabilize and make long term progress in. </p>
<p>I&#8217;d propose a Pacific Rapid Reaction Force built specifically to deal with Oceanic problems. It would initially consist of AU and NZ and later expand to include rising players. In addition, small numbers of other regional military could be embedded with the Anzacs to gain valuable trainign they can use in future interventions as well as at home. I&#8217;ll be posting about this soon.</p>
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